foultemptress
New Member
Hi, my name is Lilia and I like to rock 'n' roll...
Posts: 24
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Post by foultemptress on Nov 6, 2004 16:38:56 GMT -5
Good argument, sweetheart. *wink, slap on the ass* My whole basis for my original comment was summed up in this statement: "And let’s quickly ditch one possibility: Women aren’t great electric guitarists because they lack innate talent or discipline or musical intuition. That’s silly." It's that women are further behind in their development in becoming great guitarists because people like Chuck Berry were put out there first. Also, women aren't typically brought up to want to play guitar (that's why you see toolish guys all around college campuses trying to woo girls with their shitty songs). Also, because there aren't as many guitar goddesses as there are guitar gods (I'm talking about household names, not indie guitarists). This extreme ratio makes more boys than girls wanna go out there and be guitar gods. And since there are more well-known female singers than female guitarists, guess what? You have more girls wanting to be Britney or Christina than Joan Jett or Ann Wilson.
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Post by carlita on Nov 6, 2004 17:49:20 GMT -5
When the industry only gives you one flavor it's quite natural to think that's the only flavor out there.
Before Baskin Robbins most ice cream came in one of two varieties - chocolate or vanilla - yes, there was the occasional strawberry, but the music industry is the same way. The more flavors we see the more common they will be. But not if the industry continues to think that the public can only handle musically vanilla females packaged like Barbie Dolls.
Some radio stations actually have a POLICY to not play two female artists in a row for fear that people will turn the station.
My solution: keep playing, teach if you can. There's power in numbers and the ONLY thing the record labels will respond to are NUMBERS!!
rock on! Carla
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Post by DrkFaery07 on Nov 6, 2004 21:49:41 GMT -5
what? I never knew that! thats crazy! now im all upset....
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Post by ronald33 on Dec 15, 2004 22:30:19 GMT -5
Just read that the FIRST female electric guitarist, Cordell Jackson, died recently (Oct.04) I believe... had her own record label (Moon Records)...
Yeah, this squabble over recognition does seem to go on forever. The electric guitar DOES have potent social and sexual meaning....it's loud enough to be felt (and note: if played with a steel penis against the strings, the sound becomes, for some reason, very erotic (re: Hawaiian guitar,steel guitar---when was the last time a woman ever played one of THOSE?)
But, let's be serious: IF YOU CAN'T PLAY IT SOUNDS AND FEELS TERRIBLE! (aka NOISE). Any fool can PRETEND to play guitar and POSE with one, but it takes TALENT to BE somebody and PLAY the instru- ment with integrity...
in other words, women SHOULD be able to play JUST AS WELL AS MEN. But, alas, society discourages female guitarists....Maybe this is changing...
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Post by Maggis on Dec 26, 2004 16:32:58 GMT -5
Just read that the FIRST female electric guitarist, Cordell Jackson, died recently (Oct.04) I believe... had her own record label (Moon Records)... Yeah, this squabble over recognition does seem to go on forever. The electric guitar DOES have potent social and sexual meaning....it's loud enough to be felt (and note: if played with a steel penis against the strings, the sound becomes, for some reason, very erotic (re: Hawaiian guitar,steel guitar---when was the last time a woman ever played one of THOSE?) But, let's be serious: IF YOU CAN'T PLAY IT SOUNDS AND FEELS TERRIBLE! (aka NOISE). Any fool can PRETEND to play guitar and POSE with one, but it takes TALENT to BE somebody and PLAY the instru- ment with integrity... in other words, women SHOULD be able to play JUST AS WELL AS MEN. But, alas, society discourages female guitarists....Maybe this is changing... feeling slightly unhinged today are we?
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Post by NoSpine on Jan 25, 2005 11:24:20 GMT -5
I didn't even bother finish reading that.What an asshole!"Conventional Wisdom"?!No it's not conventional wisdom.It's sexism.
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SonicCathedral
Junior Member
Thanks for supporting Sonic Cathedral.com !
Posts: 29
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Post by SonicCathedral on Jan 26, 2005 12:36:55 GMT -5
oh...don't get your feminity in an uproar. This cat has obviously never heard Jaye Foucher, Great Kat, etc. oh... and this goob should check out: www.shredmistress.com/ adios. -rbh
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Post by WickedFemDrummer on Jan 27, 2005 13:40:41 GMT -5
Well, what can I say. Unfortunately writers are taught to back up any and all information they post in an article and so this dude went out to seek knowledge from "professors" thinking he was going to get some great dead-on answers. But, the truth is professors are TAUGHT whatever it is that they know--hence everyone is going to say something different. The answer is simple (in my eyes), and I agree 100% with FOULTEMPTRESS. There are more men than women playing "rock" instruments because that's what society has accepted. It's not because women would rather shop, it's not because we dream of being support rather than lead, it's because that's what we've been conditioned to do...it's what society has taught us. We know, the second we pick up that instrument and ROCK that we aren't following the NORM. But we dont see that many women on TV Rocking...POP culture is swarmed with MTV TRL cutesy teeny boppy Britney and wanna be prissy ballad rock from industry created people like Avril. The point is as females, society has handed us gender roles that we are expected to fill, and these roles are coming from generations of creation, hence it will take a long time to overcome. We are strong, we don't always want to be a support to someone, nurturing isn't necessarily in our blood and dammit I'm glad that there are those of us out there that fight to prove this...and no matter what they say, we can rock like any man...perhaps better (Ok, hopefully by now it's apparent that I was a Sociology major) LOL. Keep it rockin ladies...keep it rockin.
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Post by defaultuser on Feb 6, 2005 3:21:15 GMT -5
I came across this thread and I figured I would register quickly just to give my input.
first of all, "The Great Kat" Is definately one female who has pushed the limits of music with guitar. Voted #1 fastest shreder above Yngwie and Micheal Angelo. She may not be a great musician in any of your eyes, nor is she in mine, but her existance is enough to prove this guy wrong.
And its nice to see a comunity of female guitarists, rock on and take it easy.
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Post by ronald33 on Feb 6, 2005 15:26:08 GMT -5
I've heard of the Great Kat. But a lot of people don't like speed metal/thrash and don't consider it "music".
However, I'm sure that there ARE otherfemale guitar heroes out there somewhere...
And that article IS kind of unfair....because it's not Bonnie Raitt's fault she came along when she did... she IS a pioneer in my book...
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Post by vasellina on Feb 7, 2005 3:23:36 GMT -5
I can't believe no one has mentioned Carrie Brownstein yet. Sleater-Kinney is an awesome rock band that has created a sound all their own, and very obviously paved the way for many other musicians.
I don't think anyone should feel too terribly offended by that article; i just feel sorry for the author for making such a fool of himself. I was more offended by the lazy journalism than i was the sexism. The way the article reads, it's like he was patting women on the head while patting himself and all men on the back.
he just assumed that because HE was not aware of that many women who pushed the boundaries of guitar that there are none. his own sad mistake.
I should also mention Radio Sloan from The Need. she's super amazing at guitar.
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joeyangel
New Member
SHUT UP 'N PLAY YER GUITAR. . .Frank Zappa
Posts: 12
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Post by joeyangel on Feb 8, 2005 19:47:13 GMT -5
It's not just music, it's in everything. You can talk eqaulity all you want but we all know that women are considered "Second Class" citizens because it is a "Good Old Boy" world. This is true in politics, business, music. Yes, there are some powerful women who have strong positons in business and politics, and we all know that strong women are automatically considered "Bitchy!" Someone above mentioned Jennifer Batton. I knew Jennifer when I had a recording studio here in San Diego. She was a jazz player back then, but then really got into the rock thing. (You can still download her version of "Flight of the Bumble Bee" online. . . WOW!!!) The rest is history. She is a great player, and I do mean a GREAT player, but she doesn't get anymore attention then Kevin Eubanks does on the Tonight Show. Somehow, women players are still a novelty, or flash for a band. In spite of the incredible musicianship by great guitar players such as Joan Jett, Susannah Hoffs, Jennifer Batten and countless others, it seems they will never be equal. At least not yet. Right now I am teaching a fourteen year old girl to play bass, and in one year she already has the chops to play in any band. By next year she will be kicking ass with both shoes! The name of the game is to keep playing. Be inovative in your playing. Try and do things that have never been done. In the end, it's not about the flash, or how fast you play, or how many guitars you can thrash on stage or the amount of Stratcasters you can set on fire. The name of the game is expressing yourself, being yourself, saying something from the heart. If the male society doen't recognize your genius just remember that many men suffer from the same disease that have plagued men for centuries; they don't know how to listen.
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Post by pejones on May 22, 2005 22:55:22 GMT -5
this guy isn't saying that women can't rock, that there aren't good women rock guitarists....what he is saying is that none of the female rock guitarists have done anything innovative...sure bonnie raitt is good....but what she does isn't anything new....what lita ford does is good....but nothing metal heads before her haven't done...
I don't feel frustration at this author because of this....I feel frustration because alot of what he is saying is true...this article isn't an attack on women....this article is clearly an observation that there have been no women rock guitarists that have done anything astoundingly different than any male rock guitarists
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Post by Maggis on May 23, 2005 14:37:27 GMT -5
He needs to see the noisettes live then that'll change his mind.
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Post by Discordia on May 27, 2005 10:11:25 GMT -5
I can't think of too many male guitarists that have done anything particularly innovative either...unless you consider wanking off with your guitar innovative.
On second thought, I CAN think of a few female guitarists who were unique and took guitar playing to a new level. Jennifer Batten was known for her fretboard tapping with all 5 fingers, and Leona Boyd is considered the world's best classical guitarist. And I've mentioned her before, but Ellen MacIllwain is considered the godmother of slide guitar, influencing many players including Bonnie Raitt and Eric Clapton, among others.
And what about the Great Kat?? I have never heard anyone shred like she does...and no one plays Beethoven on guitar like she does! I think the guy who wrote the article was just ignorant and didn't do his research, that's all.
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